Episode 44

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Published on:

23rd Jan 2024

Wayne Mullins | CEO of Ugly Mug Marketing - Transforming Teams and Cultures

In this episode of The Last 10%, we host a fascinating conversation with successful business personality Wayne Mullins, founder of Ugly Mug Marketing. We dive into topics like developing high-performing teams and cultures and how crucial these factors are for a business's success. They discuss the concepts of cultivating consistency, creating positive work cultures, and the power of an identity-shift. This episode is full of thought-provoking questions along with real-life anecdotes to make this a highly engaging and educational listening experience for every leader, coach, and entrepreneur. Join us on the show!

Wayne's Information

Company Website

Instagram

Mentioned in this episode:

1on1 App Information

https://www.thinkmovethrive.com/1on1-app/

Transcript
Dallas Burnett:

Hey everybody.

Dallas Burnett:

We're talking to Wayne Mullins today.

Dallas Burnett:

What an amazing guy.

Dallas Burnett:

He's the founder of Ugly Mug Marketing, entrepreneur and creator

Dallas Burnett:

of the Freelance Accelerator.

Dallas Burnett:

He's got some incredible stories about developing high

Dallas Burnett:

performing teams and culture.

Dallas Burnett:

He's a great new friend of mine.

Dallas Burnett:

You don't want to miss.

Dallas Burnett:

This incredible conversation.

DJ:

Welcome to the last 10 percent your host, Dallas Burnett dives into

DJ:

incredible conversations that will inspire you to finish well and finish strong.

DJ:

Listen, as guests share their journeys and valuable advice on living in the last 10%,

DJ:

if you are a leader, a coach, a business owner, or someone looking to level up.

DJ:

You are in the right place.

DJ:

Remember, you can give 90 percent effort and make it a long way.

DJ:

But it's finding out how to unlock the last 10 percent that makes

DJ:

all the difference in your life, your relationships, and your work.

DJ:

Now, here's Dallas.

Dallas Burnett:

Welcome, welcome, welcome.

Dallas Burnett:

I am Dallas Burnett, sitting in my 1905 Koch Brothers

Dallas Burnett:

barber chair in Thrive Studios.

Dallas Burnett:

But more importantly, we have a great guest today.

Dallas Burnett:

Mr.

Dallas Burnett:

Wayne Mullins has influenced over 250, 000 entrepreneurs a year.

Dallas Burnett:

So I can't wait to get into that.

Dallas Burnett:

So welcome to the show, Wayne.

Dallas Burnett:

Thank

Wayne Mullins:

you so much, Dallas.

Wayne Mullins:

I'm excited for our chat today and looking forward to an inspiring conversation.

Dallas Burnett:

Oh, that's awesome.

Dallas Burnett:

So.

Dallas Burnett:

You, and you influence a lot of entrepreneurs.

Dallas Burnett:

Tell us, how do you come in contact and influence so many

Dallas Burnett:

entrepreneurs every single year?

Dallas Burnett:

Sure.

Wayne Mullins:

Absolutely.

Wayne Mullins:

There's several different ways that occurs.

Wayne Mullins:

One is through social platforms.

Wayne Mullins:

Obviously, social media is a thing now that enables us to connect and

Wayne Mullins:

communicate and inspire other people.

Wayne Mullins:

And what's so interesting about that, I was just overhearing some

Wayne Mullins:

conversation yesterday evening.

Wayne Mullins:

And someone was commenting on a post that I had made and they were talking to

Wayne Mullins:

somebody else saying, you know, I really love all the posts that Wayne does.

Wayne Mullins:

And what's interesting to me is I've never once seen that person

Wayne Mullins:

like comment, share or any other way visibly that I would know.

Wayne Mullins:

So.

Wayne Mullins:

I think an important thing to remember for everyone out there is that your

Wayne Mullins:

words, your stories, the things you're communicating on these social

Wayne Mullins:

platforms is making a difference.

Wayne Mullins:

It is impacting others, even if you never see the visible evidence of it.

Wayne Mullins:

So that's one way also have some online courses.

Wayne Mullins:

We have over 20, 000 students enrolled in, uh, one of our online courses and

Wayne Mullins:

speaking Through a book, I've got a book out there that sells quite well.

Wayne Mullins:

So all of those different

Dallas Burnett:

ways.

Dallas Burnett:

That's awesome.

Dallas Burnett:

That will do it.

Dallas Burnett:

That would do it.

Dallas Burnett:

Wonderful.

Dallas Burnett:

That's awesome.

Dallas Burnett:

I can't wait to get into talking about some of this today.

Dallas Burnett:

Now you have, you are the founder of a marketing agency

Dallas Burnett:

called Ugly Mug Marketing.

Dallas Burnett:

And I got to ask, first of all, tell us how you got into that.

Dallas Burnett:

And second of all, you got to tell us where the name Ugly Mug

Dallas Burnett:

Marketing came from, because that sounds like a fun story.

Wayne Mullins:

Yeah, absolutely.

Wayne Mullins:

I got into marketing as a result of going into sales.

Wayne Mullins:

So we were chatting before we started recording here.

Wayne Mullins:

Zig Ziglar had a huge impact.

Wayne Mullins:

I On me when I was in college, uh, for some reason, my parents gave

Wayne Mullins:

me a set of CDs from Zig Ziglar.

Wayne Mullins:

I still to this day, don't know why they gave me those CDs, but it was

Wayne Mullins:

Zig Ziglar talking about the sales profession in through those CDs.

Wayne Mullins:

What Zig did was he sold me on the profession of selling.

Wayne Mullins:

In other words, at that point, from that point forward, I

Wayne Mullins:

knew I wanted to go into sales.

Wayne Mullins:

And that's exactly what I did.

Wayne Mullins:

And that sales journey led me down a path, which turned into

Wayne Mullins:

some marketing consulting.

Wayne Mullins:

And at some point that turned into the opportunity to actually open an agency.

Wayne Mullins:

And that's been about 15 years ago now.

Dallas Burnett:

Wow.

Dallas Burnett:

That's awesome.

Dallas Burnett:

I feel like we have, we're like minded in that.

Dallas Burnett:

I still remember getting out of school and really not having a development

Dallas Burnett:

mindset at that point in time, just because you come out of school and

Dallas Burnett:

you're just like, man, I'm tired of just.

Dallas Burnett:

You know, learning all this stuff, but it was mainly, I was learning

Dallas Burnett:

things I wasn't interested in.

Dallas Burnett:

And then.

Dallas Burnett:

Somebody, I don't even know how I got turned on to Zig Ziglar, but I

Dallas Burnett:

just remember I was driving in car.

Dallas Burnett:

I mean, I would be on some trip and it would be hours of just me and Zig.

Dallas Burnett:

And, and just, I just ate it up and I just chewed up everything he had.

Dallas Burnett:

And so it was so good, such an inspiring guy and had such a way of.

Dallas Burnett:

Of his perspective was just fantastic in the way he framed

Dallas Burnett:

his ideas were just incredible.

Dallas Burnett:

It was so polished and it was very inspiring.

Dallas Burnett:

So yeah, man, I'm feeling you on the Zig Ziglar, man.

Dallas Burnett:

He was the man.

Dallas Burnett:

So tell us a little bit about how, where did Ugly Mug come from?

Dallas Burnett:

Like how, what was the genesis of Ugly Mug?

Dallas Burnett:

Sure.

Dallas Burnett:

So I

Wayne Mullins:

started the career in sales, quickly learned that I

Wayne Mullins:

sucked at this thing called selling, but thanks to my stubbornness.

Wayne Mullins:

Thanks to Zig continually, you know, quote unquote preaching in my year about

Wayne Mullins:

selling and developing my sales skills.

Wayne Mullins:

I finally got good at this thing of selling.

Wayne Mullins:

And you know, Dallas, one of these dangerous things occurred

Wayne Mullins:

as I got better at selling.

Wayne Mullins:

The amount of revenue that I was making for the company started going up at

Wayne Mullins:

a higher rate than mine was going up.

Wayne Mullins:

Both were going up, but the company's revenue was going up.

Wayne Mullins:

Yeah.

Wayne Mullins:

It was spiking a bit more.

Wayne Mullins:

And so I had this dangerous thought, what if I actually went

Wayne Mullins:

and did something for myself?

Wayne Mullins:

What if I went and sold something for myself?

Wayne Mullins:

At that point in time, the only other skill that I had was cutting grass.

Wayne Mullins:

So I'm here in Louisiana.

Wayne Mullins:

The grass cutting season here is nine months out of the year and all

Wayne Mullins:

through high school and college.

Wayne Mullins:

That's what I did.

Wayne Mullins:

Summertime, I was cutting grass for money, making money.

Wayne Mullins:

And so then much to the dismay of my parents, to some friends, I left

Wayne Mullins:

this wonderful sales job, corporate job, eight to five, money through

Wayne Mullins:

Friday, all the benefits, and, you know, really decent pay and decided

Wayne Mullins:

to start a lawn and landscape company.

Wayne Mullins:

It was a year period, the next three years, I grew that from nothing.

Wayne Mullins:

I'd, you know, since stopped doing it when I started doing sales.

Wayne Mullins:

I grew that into the largest lawn and landscape company in our region.

Wayne Mullins:

And during the course of that growth, I started having a lot of other

Wayne Mullins:

entrepreneurs, business owners.

Wayne Mullins:

A lot of them were actually clients of the lawn and landscape company come to

Wayne Mullins:

me saying, what are you doing to grow?

Wayne Mullins:

You know, they'd seen the journey Dallas.

Wayne Mullins:

They'd seen me go from myself in a truck to myself and a crew myself

Wayne Mullins:

in another crew and another truck.

Wayne Mullins:

Right.

Wayne Mullins:

So they'd seen this progression over this relatively short period of time.

Wayne Mullins:

And so the question started coming, what are you doing to grow at that pace?

Wayne Mullins:

And the answer was marketing.

Wayne Mullins:

We were doing some very unique, very specific things from marketing,

Wayne Mullins:

from our marketing perspective, and those conversations led into

Wayne Mullins:

consulting, right, people paying for input, paying for advice.

Wayne Mullins:

And at some point there was just enough of that, that I had this other crazy idea.

Wayne Mullins:

What if I did this for a job, right?

Wayne Mullins:

What if I started a company and did this?

Dallas Burnett:

How about that?

Dallas Burnett:

That's awesome.

Dallas Burnett:

I love that story.

Dallas Burnett:

I love how you just flipped it and you just went.

Dallas Burnett:

Where you saw opportunity and you started in sales and then saw this

Dallas Burnett:

opportunity in something you'd already known when you were working in college

Dallas Burnett:

and you followed that opportunity.

Dallas Burnett:

And then that opened up the door to a completely new opportunity.

Dallas Burnett:

I love that.

Dallas Burnett:

And I think that's such a journey of entrepreneurship is that the place

Dallas Burnett:

that you start is so oftentimes not the place that you finish or land the plane.

Dallas Burnett:

It's just, it is a circuitous path.

Dallas Burnett:

And that's awesome.

Dallas Burnett:

That ugly mug.

Dallas Burnett:

And let's talk a little bit about this because in the Zig Ziglar

Dallas Burnett:

frame of mind, we were talking about how Zig Ziglar approaches things.

Dallas Burnett:

There's a big part of that in terms of his perspective, in terms of

Dallas Burnett:

routines and you have doing the routines well and staying consistent.

Dallas Burnett:

You have some really good, solid routines.

Dallas Burnett:

And we've talked about a little bit of the short for the show, but I'd love

Dallas Burnett:

for you to talk a little bit about.

Dallas Burnett:

You know, what is some routines that you felt like you've developed over

Dallas Burnett:

the years that's really helped you in your life and in your business?

Wayne Mullins:

Sure.

Wayne Mullins:

If you are right, Zig Ziglar was very much one who advocated understanding

Wayne Mullins:

the foundational elements.

Wayne Mullins:

So when he talked about cells, it was about the foundation of

Wayne Mullins:

human psychology and a persuasion.

Wayne Mullins:

And so really for me, what I've always loved is trying to figure out

Wayne Mullins:

what are the foundational pieces.

Wayne Mullins:

What are the basic pieces that the really great people do that other

Wayne Mullins:

people have already forgotten.

Wayne Mullins:

So when I look around at the entrepreneurs, when I work, look around

Wayne Mullins:

at athletes, one of the things that's so fascinating to me is what separates

Wayne Mullins:

average or even good from great is that the great know the foundational things.

Wayne Mullins:

So much better than those below them and it goes back to, you know, I'm

Wayne Mullins:

reminded of the John Wooden story, the UCLA basketball coach, the most

Wayne Mullins:

winning coach in collegiate history in their first day of practice.

Wayne Mullins:

Right.

Wayne Mullins:

So first of all, he has the absolute best college basketball players in

Wayne Mullins:

the country because they'd already been winning national championships.

Wayne Mullins:

So he had his pick literally of all the high school graduates

Wayne Mullins:

who he wanted to choose from.

Wayne Mullins:

So these are the top high school graduates coming to play on his team.

Wayne Mullins:

And the very first day of practice, he teaches them how to put on

Wayne Mullins:

their socks correctly, right?

Wayne Mullins:

It's a foundational thing.

Wayne Mullins:

Like you wouldn't think you'd be teaching high school all star basketball

Wayne Mullins:

players how to put on their socks.

Wayne Mullins:

But his whole premise was you put your socks on wrong, incorrectly.

Wayne Mullins:

You're going to get a blister, you get a blister, you're going to miss practice.

Wayne Mullins:

You miss practice.

Wayne Mullins:

You're going to miss games.

Wayne Mullins:

You miss games.

Wayne Mullins:

You're going to cause us to lose.

Wayne Mullins:

He would then move into how do you tie your shoe so that it doesn't come untied.

Wayne Mullins:

And again, those things for me, I had to learn over the years.

Wayne Mullins:

What are those foundational elements?

Wayne Mullins:

Put me in the best position to win day in and day out.

Wayne Mullins:

And, you know, my story, Dallas.

Wayne Mullins:

My journey hasn't been this linear path upwards, right?

Wayne Mullins:

Like so many others, my path has been full of a lot of ups and downs.

Wayne Mullins:

And some of those downs were pretty dark and pretty deep places.

Wayne Mullins:

You know, at one point we, my company was investigated by the FBI, the actual FBI.

Wayne Mullins:

And the company at the time, we weren't even doing well, right?

Wayne Mullins:

So it's not like we were super successful and we got investigated.

Wayne Mullins:

We weren't doing well.

Wayne Mullins:

And so this whole process really put me into a state of deep

Wayne Mullins:

depression, extreme depression.

Wayne Mullins:

I'd never experienced anything like that in my life, you know, struggled

Wayne Mullins:

just to get out of bed in the mornings.

Wayne Mullins:

It was to the point Dallas that I didn't want to live.

Wayne Mullins:

I reached that point where.

Wayne Mullins:

I didn't want to live and I had no hope.

Wayne Mullins:

I had no, you know, the future was not bright whatsoever.

Wayne Mullins:

And through the course of just some small interactions, what I discovered

Wayne Mullins:

was that some of the foundational pieces that I need to succeed.

Wayne Mullins:

We're not in place.

Wayne Mullins:

So when the storm comes, right, when this whole thing took place,

Wayne Mullins:

there was not a solid foundation.

Wayne Mullins:

So I was very susceptible to go down this path of depression.

Wayne Mullins:

And so that's for me, what really started this idea, this whole journey

Wayne Mullins:

towards figuring out what are the foundational pieces that I need in my

Wayne Mullins:

life to ensure that I'm on good footing.

Wayne Mullins:

I love how

Wayne Mullins:

you

Dallas Burnett:

talk about it as it relates to performance

Dallas Burnett:

and starting with the basics.

Dallas Burnett:

And I feel like that's exactly right.

Dallas Burnett:

I just, when we had another guest on that was a performance psychologist

Dallas Burnett:

for a major league baseball team, and he said something similar in the sense

Dallas Burnett:

that he was always amazed at how the great players did the mundane things

Dallas Burnett:

with excellence and so consistent.

Dallas Burnett:

And it was this, these things that are typically, like you said, other

Dallas Burnett:

people have already forgotten, they've moved on to the next thing.

Dallas Burnett:

And, you know, whether it's a great athlete or a great business person

Dallas Burnett:

is just getting down and doing the simple things so consistently and

Dallas Burnett:

so well that the foundation that you have is so strong that you end

Dallas Burnett:

up getting and creating the results because you've got a great foundation.

Dallas Burnett:

And I love that.

Dallas Burnett:

I love how you frame that up.

Dallas Burnett:

And I think that's very true.

Dallas Burnett:

I think that so many times people get impatient or they're, they

Dallas Burnett:

get distracted by something.

Dallas Burnett:

You know, bright and shiny and on the next thing, and they forget sometimes

Dallas Burnett:

the fundamentals or we get sloppy.

Dallas Burnett:

We just have this performance drift on the fundamentals.

Dallas Burnett:

And, and I think that's, that's so true.

Dallas Burnett:

I think we're routines, especially in our routines, create and make who we are.

Dallas Burnett:

And so focusing on the basics of routines is definitely going to help us create.

Dallas Burnett:

Whether it's the business or the team.

Dallas Burnett:

Or the performance, whatever we're in that we want.

Dallas Burnett:

So I love that.

Dallas Burnett:

I love that.

Dallas Burnett:

What's some of your go to routines?

Dallas Burnett:

You say some foundational routines.

Dallas Burnett:

What are some of the routines that you say are go to?

Wayne Mullins:

Absolutely.

Wayne Mullins:

So for me, you know, they all, a lot of these started when I was trying

Wayne Mullins:

to work through that depression and come out of that period in my life.

Wayne Mullins:

So for me, number one, it was getting up at a consistent time.

Wayne Mullins:

So I wake up at 5 0 5 AM.

Wayne Mullins:

Seven days a week, 365 days a year.

Wayne Mullins:

It doesn't matter if I'm sick with fever.

Wayne Mullins:

It doesn't matter if I'm on vacation.

Wayne Mullins:

It doesn't matter if it's Christmas.

Wayne Mullins:

It doesn't matter.

Wayne Mullins:

The day does not matter.

Wayne Mullins:

I'm waking up at 5 0 5 AM.

Wayne Mullins:

And the reason that I had to be so rigid with that is what I've learned for myself.

Wayne Mullins:

And this may not be true for others, but what I've learned for myself

Wayne Mullins:

is that exceptions become the norm.

Wayne Mullins:

So when I would give myself a pass, when I would make an exception, you

Wayne Mullins:

know, I didn't sleep well last night, so I'm going to hit snooze a few times.

Wayne Mullins:

Then the next day it was, you know, what, you know, whatever,

Wayne Mullins:

it's the weekend or it's a holiday or we're on vacation, right?

Wayne Mullins:

There's always an exception.

Wayne Mullins:

And so for me, I just said, you know what?

Wayne Mullins:

No exceptions, 5 0 5.

Wayne Mullins:

seven days a week, 365 days a year.

Wayne Mullins:

So I've been doing that now for probably four or five years straight.

Wayne Mullins:

I don't remember the exact timeframe, but for me, that morning time is where I

Wayne Mullins:

needed the time to start my day correctly.

Wayne Mullins:

I'm married.

Wayne Mullins:

We have four kids.

Wayne Mullins:

And during this period, as anyone who's parent understand once the kids are awake.

Wayne Mullins:

And you're at home, you really don't have much time to focus on yourself.

Wayne Mullins:

There's not much quiet time in a house with kids present.

Wayne Mullins:

Yeah.

Wayne Mullins:

So that's exactly right.

Wayne Mullins:

Yeah.

Wayne Mullins:

So my routine would start at five Oh five.

Wayne Mullins:

I would begin the day with some meditation.

Wayne Mullins:

So I use an app called calm.

Wayne Mullins:

It's just a guided meditation.

Wayne Mullins:

And all I really do is a breathing exercise.

Wayne Mullins:

It just really helps me to remind myself that.

Wayne Mullins:

The thoughts can come, but I don't have to latch onto those thoughts, right?

Wayne Mullins:

I don't have to believe or pursue every single thought that comes my

Wayne Mullins:

way, that I can just see the thoughts, watch them pass and let them move on.

Wayne Mullins:

The next thing I do is I spend 15 to 20 minutes reading, and that is

Wayne Mullins:

always something very intentional.

Wayne Mullins:

Now, that varies based on where I'm at, what I'm feeling

Wayne Mullins:

in that period of my life.

Wayne Mullins:

So I will make sure that I'm reading something that's going

Wayne Mullins:

to serve me in that period.

Wayne Mullins:

I also journal.

Wayne Mullins:

So I don't spend a ton of time journaling, but I like to put

Wayne Mullins:

down some thoughts on paper.

Wayne Mullins:

It could be just how I'm feeling that morning.

Wayne Mullins:

It could be something, you know, an instance or an event that's

Wayne Mullins:

taking place in my life at the time.

Wayne Mullins:

Yeah.

Wayne Mullins:

And then the other thing is exercise.

Wayne Mullins:

I started six years ago running.

Wayne Mullins:

I was never a runner.

Wayne Mullins:

I'd never ran at all for anything.

Wayne Mullins:

And I started running and you know, the first year I ran

Wayne Mullins:

a couple of hundred miles.

Wayne Mullins:

The next year I progressed that in those foundational pieces

Wayne Mullins:

that took place in the morning.

Wayne Mullins:

So between five o'clock in the morning and between seven o'clock in the morning.

Wayne Mullins:

Those foundational pieces, I would argue, has what enabled my company to

Wayne Mullins:

thrive over the last few years, I would argue that it has enabled me to invest

Wayne Mullins:

in my marriage, to invest in my kids and in those relationships as well.

Dallas Burnett:

I love that.

Dallas Burnett:

I think that's interesting too.

Dallas Burnett:

And I love your, it's a mindfulness meditation that you at least are

Dallas Burnett:

describing at least what I've understood.

Dallas Burnett:

And we have similar morning routines.

Dallas Burnett:

I get up.

Dallas Burnett:

At the same time every day, I think one of the things it's so

Dallas Burnett:

interesting the way you describe that the exception becomes the norm.

Dallas Burnett:

Oh my gosh.

Dallas Burnett:

I love how you put that.

Dallas Burnett:

And I think it is because when we give ourselves, it just keeps it simple.

Dallas Burnett:

You eliminate decisions when you say there is no exception.

Dallas Burnett:

It's this every single day.

Dallas Burnett:

Then I'm not saying it's today.

Dallas Burnett:

The day I get to sleep in is today.

Dallas Burnett:

The day I get to skip working out is today.

Dallas Burnett:

The day that I can just roll it.

Dallas Burnett:

You just don't, you don't have to make that decision.

Dallas Burnett:

You just like, no, today is the day today.

Dallas Burnett:

Every day I get up at five and that's what we're going to do.

Dallas Burnett:

We're rolling with it.

Dallas Burnett:

And so I think.

Dallas Burnett:

Not having to decide and make as many decisions helps you be more consistent.

Dallas Burnett:

Because if you're not having to make a decision, then you don't have to

Dallas Burnett:

worry about making the wrong one.

Wayne Mullins:

Yeah.

Wayne Mullins:

It's really good.

Wayne Mullins:

What I've observed is that it becomes your identity.

Wayne Mullins:

So for me in writing, for example, I was never a runner and it took me probably

Wayne Mullins:

a couple of years before I started identifying As a runner and once your

Wayne Mullins:

identity shifts So once your identity becomes someone who wakes up at five every

Wayne Mullins:

morning, it's abnormal It's not who you are to sleep in once you become a runner.

Wayne Mullins:

What do you want to do?

Wayne Mullins:

You want to run?

Wayne Mullins:

And so I think one of the hacks, if there was going to be a hack around this, it

Wayne Mullins:

would be the sooner that you can learn to shape your identity, to believe that

Wayne Mullins:

you are that type of person, the easier and the quicker you will establish

Wayne Mullins:

the habits that you want in your life.

Dallas Burnett:

Oh, listen, I, I, let me tell you, I've got a

Dallas Burnett:

story on that one because we had.

Dallas Burnett:

We were developing this coaching system for a client, which is now the one on

Dallas Burnett:

one coaching system that we have as an app that we have, we install in a lot

Dallas Burnett:

of different clients, but when we were at the genesis of that, we had no idea

Dallas Burnett:

if it was going to be successful or not.

Dallas Burnett:

And we had one of the operations managers was like, share the kind

Dallas Burnett:

of, take the, take me through.

Dallas Burnett:

This one on one coaching session in front of a couple of project managers.

Dallas Burnett:

I was like, okay.

Dallas Burnett:

And he was like saying, Hey, look, guys, look, this is what's coming.

Dallas Burnett:

He's getting pat on the back that he's giving them the inside.

Dallas Burnett:

You know, this is what's coming down the line.

Dallas Burnett:

And so we just went through a coaching session right there in front of them.

Dallas Burnett:

And we get done and we look, I turned around, look at the guy.

Dallas Burnett:

I'll never guess, Hey, what do you think?

Dallas Burnett:

I got nothing.

Dallas Burnett:

Total deadpan.

Dallas Burnett:

I mean, zero response.

Dallas Burnett:

Yeah.

Dallas Burnett:

Okay.

Dallas Burnett:

And then they get up and it's like, it's over.

Dallas Burnett:

I'm like, okay, this is not good.

Dallas Burnett:

This is going to be bad.

Dallas Burnett:

So they leave, this was like a Thursday, a Friday, Saturday, Sunday, nothing.

Dallas Burnett:

I come back on Monday morning, the office manager's not going to work.

Dallas Burnett:

Doo, doo, doo.

Dallas Burnett:

He's like, dude, you're not gonna believe what just happened.

Dallas Burnett:

I'm like, what?

Dallas Burnett:

He's like, one of those project managers like came in this morning, met with

Dallas Burnett:

me first thing, so I just want to let you know, I quit smoking this weekend.

Dallas Burnett:

He's like.

Dallas Burnett:

He goes, yeah, he's like, you know, you asked for a commitment and after

Dallas Burnett:

you ask those questions in the coaching session, I just start thinking about

Dallas Burnett:

him all the way home and I started thinking I need to make a commitment.

Dallas Burnett:

And then I started thinking about my kid that's on the way and I started

Dallas Burnett:

seeing how much money I spend on smoking and booze and all that stuff.

Dallas Burnett:

He's like, I'm done.

Dallas Burnett:

I just quit.

Dallas Burnett:

I'm not a smoker anymore.

Dallas Burnett:

He went cold turkey.

Dallas Burnett:

No Nick patch, no nothing because he said, I'm not a smoker anymore.

Dallas Burnett:

And he came back Monday.

Dallas Burnett:

That was like, he had been smoked for like 15 years.

Dallas Burnett:

And that was like three or four years ago.

Dallas Burnett:

And the guy hadn't touched his sense.

Dallas Burnett:

I mean, it was done now.

Dallas Burnett:

I'm not Tony Robbins and this is the coaching system isn't either, but

Dallas Burnett:

that guy's just to, to your point, that's the power of an identity shift.

Dallas Burnett:

He shifted from, I use cigarettes to calm my nerves to, I want to take my

Dallas Burnett:

newborn daughter on nice vacations.

Dallas Burnett:

And I'm the dad that gets to do that.

Dallas Burnett:

And like when he made that switch over the course of a weekend, it

Dallas Burnett:

was so transformative in his life.

Dallas Burnett:

It just changed his whole life.

Dallas Burnett:

And so I think that's really amazing.

Dallas Burnett:

And I do think that I like how you said identity, because I think that

Dallas Burnett:

it does how we perceive ourself and what we believe about ourself.

Dallas Burnett:

It's going to jingle all the way in shaping our reality.

Dallas Burnett:

So do you have any other thoughts on that?

Dallas Burnett:

Like, how have you seen people or ideas that you have around how

Dallas Burnett:

people would shape their identity?

Dallas Burnett:

Cause I think that's a cool concept.

Wayne Mullins:

Yeah, I think, you know, whether we acknowledge

Wayne Mullins:

it or not, it is true.

Wayne Mullins:

You always behave in a manner that is consistent with the way you see yourself.

Wayne Mullins:

Now, for some people, you may look around at the evidence in your life and you

Wayne Mullins:

may No, that's not true because I don't want to be doing A, B, C, or D, right?

Wayne Mullins:

I have these bad habits that I don't want.

Wayne Mullins:

But the reality is your identity is that person, still.

Wayne Mullins:

You may be at war with those things.

Wayne Mullins:

Your identity is that you're the person who is at war

Wayne Mullins:

with these bad habits, right?

Wayne Mullins:

Until your identity shifts to the person who doesn't struggle to quit smoking.

Wayne Mullins:

Until your identity shifts to the person who doesn't struggle to wake

Wayne Mullins:

up when the alarm clock goes off.

Wayne Mullins:

Until your identity shifts to the person who loves to run or loves to work out,

Wayne Mullins:

you are stuck fighting that battle because your identity is in that battle.

Wayne Mullins:

And this is true in all aspects of our lives, you know, for example, in the

Wayne Mullins:

business world, in the business context, I spent probably the first seven years of

Wayne Mullins:

ugly mug marketing, not believing that I knew how to lead people and manage people

Wayne Mullins:

well, and you see that came from the previous business, the lawn and landscape

Wayne Mullins:

company, I had run into some managerial, some leadership challenges in that

Wayne Mullins:

business that really deflated my belief in myself as a leader and as a manager.

Wayne Mullins:

So I carried that identity over with me into this business.

Wayne Mullins:

And so it's funny, you talk to some people who have known me over these

Wayne Mullins:

years that I've had ugly mug marketing.

Wayne Mullins:

And I had some advisors and some mentors that I used to go to all

Wayne Mullins:

that I would ever talk about.

Wayne Mullins:

I would complain about the team.

Wayne Mullins:

I would complain about that.

Wayne Mullins:

I couldn't leave that.

Wayne Mullins:

I was tired of dealing with people that I hated managing all of these things.

Wayne Mullins:

But it wasn't until my identity shifted that I chose to believe I don't have

Wayne Mullins:

to be a bad manager, a bad leader, that I can choose the identity to be

Wayne Mullins:

a great leader and a great manager.

Wayne Mullins:

It was at that point.

Wayne Mullins:

That everything began shifting, everything began changing.

Wayne Mullins:

And to this day, I lean into that, right?

Wayne Mullins:

Is it who I naturally am?

Wayne Mullins:

No, I'm a high level introvert.

Wayne Mullins:

I would much rather go hide in the corner, hide in the room than lead or manage.

Wayne Mullins:

But I'm leaning into that identity in attempting to use that to

Wayne Mullins:

build the team and the culture and the business that I want.

Dallas Burnett:

I think that's a great point.

Dallas Burnett:

And I think that's said, and I think that you're exactly right.

Dallas Burnett:

And I think so many times.

Dallas Burnett:

People mistakenly believe that they are just in the battle and that's a good

Dallas Burnett:

thing that eventually, you know, it's like, okay, I just got to keep fighting.

Dallas Burnett:

And one day, I love your perspective is that believe you've won,

Dallas Burnett:

believe you're out, you're done.

Dallas Burnett:

And that way you're not having to get up every day and be like, am I

Dallas Burnett:

going to have to battle to get up?

Dallas Burnett:

Am I going to battle to quit smoking?

Dallas Burnett:

I'm like, it doesn't have to be a battle.

Dallas Burnett:

And I think that's really putting a fork into your identity and really resting in

Dallas Burnett:

awareness that you have about yourself, your strengths and your abilities and

Dallas Burnett:

your uniqueness and, and then just running with it and say, let's go.

Dallas Burnett:

So I think that's very encouraging.

Dallas Burnett:

I would say if you're leading a team, if you're coaching individuals, if you're

Dallas Burnett:

growing a company, I think that you really need to spend some time You know,

Dallas Burnett:

asking yourself what you really believe.

Dallas Burnett:

And I think that it's easy for sometimes for people to say, well, of course I

Dallas Burnett:

believe I'm this or I'm that and it's good, but they're not acting in a way.

Dallas Burnett:

So if you really want to know what you believe, watch how you behave.

Dallas Burnett:

And if you struggle getting them out of bed or you struggle quitting

Dallas Burnett:

smoking, then you really need to say, maybe I don't really believe,

Dallas Burnett:

maybe there's some things that I need to, to unpack a little bit more.

Dallas Burnett:

So I think that's really good.

Dallas Burnett:

That's really good.

Dallas Burnett:

I want to move on.

Dallas Burnett:

I want to talk a little bit about, I want to talk about, you're a marketing expert.

Dallas Burnett:

You've been doing this for a long time.

Dallas Burnett:

And honestly, it's funny because you were talking about the FBI.

Dallas Burnett:

I'm sitting there thinking this is ironic because you're like, everything

Dallas Burnett:

started turning around, the business started going better, and the lives of.

Dallas Burnett:

Literally own your company.

Dallas Burnett:

One of your, one of your like recommendations like that to own

Dallas Burnett:

your thing is from Chris Voss.

Dallas Burnett:

And if anybody's listened to this and loves the book, splitting the difference,

Dallas Burnett:

which is like this massive bestseller from an FBI to the top negotiator.

Dallas Burnett:

It's like, literally he's saying how awesome you guys are.

Dallas Burnett:

And I'm sitting there thinking that's a long way from getting.

Dallas Burnett:

Going through this investigation thing from the FBI to now having

Dallas Burnett:

Chris Voss recommend you, I was like, wow, that's amazing.

Dallas Burnett:

So well done with that on that, but I'd love to talk since

Dallas Burnett:

you're an expert in marketing.

Dallas Burnett:

I want to first talk and give some listeners some ideas if they are

Dallas Burnett:

leading a team or business and they're thinking about marketing.

Dallas Burnett:

Maybe they are not getting what they want out of their marketing.

Dallas Burnett:

Maybe they're not even doing marketing at all.

Dallas Burnett:

Or maybe they're not happy with the marketing that they are doing.

Dallas Burnett:

So tell us what is something, I would say, rookie mistakes or mistakes that you see

Dallas Burnett:

owners or leaders making when they engage in marketing their services or their

Wayne Mullins:

products.

Wayne Mullins:

Yeah, there's too many mistakes that I see people make, Dallas.

Wayne Mullins:

And it's not because they're ignorant or it's not because they don't want to

Wayne Mullins:

do the right thing with their marketing.

Wayne Mullins:

It is because there's so much noise out there.

Wayne Mullins:

Like, who do you believe?

Wayne Mullins:

Who do you listen to, right?

Wayne Mullins:

And there's a new guru born every day who's telling you to

Wayne Mullins:

do this thing or that thing.

Wayne Mullins:

But the two things that come to mind when I think about the biggest

Wayne Mullins:

mistakes that I see consistently made, number one is that most people

Wayne Mullins:

confuse marketing with advertising.

Wayne Mullins:

And they use those two terms interchangeably.

Wayne Mullins:

And marketing and advertising are not the exact same thing.

Wayne Mullins:

So advertising is merely a piece or a component of your marketing.

Wayne Mullins:

And you can't use those terms interchangeably

Wayne Mullins:

because they're not the same.

Wayne Mullins:

So then the question is, what is marketing the way we like to define it?

Wayne Mullins:

And again, there's not a right or wrong, but the way we like to define

Wayne Mullins:

it is marketing is your ability to attract and to keep a customer.

Wayne Mullins:

So the attraction side.

Wayne Mullins:

A lot about the advertising, right?

Wayne Mullins:

Is how are we going to get our message out there to the right people in the right

Wayne Mullins:

way and own the right platform or the right media so that it resonates, so that

Wayne Mullins:

it connects, so that it speaks to them.

Wayne Mullins:

Now, the interesting thing, Dallas is the keeping side.

Wayne Mullins:

This is a side that I would say that 99 percent of even marketers.

Wayne Mullins:

Overlook, we've been trained as marketers, as even as salespeople,

Wayne Mullins:

we've been trained that our job is to bring people to the point of sell,

Wayne Mullins:

to the point where they pull out their wallet and they hand us money.

Wayne Mullins:

And then what do we do if we're in sales?

Wayne Mullins:

We're out looking for the next people to bring through the sales process again.

Wayne Mullins:

And marketers do the same thing, right?

Wayne Mullins:

We have been trained to find the strangers out there, convert those

Wayne Mullins:

strangers into friends, and then turn those friends into customers.

Wayne Mullins:

And then we run out and we go try to find more strangers.

Wayne Mullins:

And we repeat where I truly believe, and there's evidence of this all around

Wayne Mullins:

right now, but what I truly believe is going to be the ultimate hack.

Wayne Mullins:

If you will, I hate the word hack, but ultimate marketing hack for the future.

Wayne Mullins:

It's this learning to use your marketing skills, your sales skills

Wayne Mullins:

to turn your ordinary customers.

Wayne Mullins:

Into evangelist for your brand.

Wayne Mullins:

That is where the opportunity lies because while everyone else is running

Wayne Mullins:

out, they're trying to go convince the next strangers to become friends, to then

Wayne Mullins:

pull out their wallet and hand us money.

Wayne Mullins:

If you take and you convert your existing clientele into evangelists

Wayne Mullins:

for you, you now have an.

Wayne Mullins:

Army who is doing that work for you.

Wayne Mullins:

And if you look around, you will see evidence that the best brands,

Wayne Mullins:

the brands that people love to talk about are brilliant at turning

Wayne Mullins:

their customers into evangelists.

Dallas Burnett:

I love that.

Dallas Burnett:

That is awesome.

Dallas Burnett:

That is great advice.

Dallas Burnett:

And I love the nuance that you put on the marketing and advertising

Dallas Burnett:

and the differences between the two.

Dallas Burnett:

I think there's a lot, I think there's a lot there.

Dallas Burnett:

Also, I would love for you to talk a little bit about, because I think

Dallas Burnett:

that as leaders or coaches or business owners, I don't want people to get caught

Dallas Burnett:

up in that this is just a marketing conversation because in the standpoint

Dallas Burnett:

of external marketing, because we can talk about social media, we can talk

Dallas Burnett:

about advertising, we can talk about clients, but we also have a component of

Dallas Burnett:

internal marketing as well to our teams, to our companies, to our organizations.

Dallas Burnett:

And so I would love to, for you to just think through and talk with us a little

Dallas Burnett:

bit about how you feel like the principles of marketing, how leaders and coaches

Dallas Burnett:

can utilize some principles that may be used in marketing to be better leaders.

Dallas Burnett:

And, or coaches specifically too, I'd love to hit on storytelling

Dallas Burnett:

cause I think that marketers

Wayne Mullins:

are great storytellers.

Wayne Mullins:

Yeah.

Wayne Mullins:

I think you're spot on that so often we think marketing is a department

Wayne Mullins:

or we think sales is a department.

Wayne Mullins:

And in reality, so much of our lives are about selling.

Wayne Mullins:

They're about persuasion.

Wayne Mullins:

They're about marketing.

Wayne Mullins:

And you know, when you think about your role, whatever that role may be, assuming

Wayne Mullins:

it's not in marketing, it's not in sales.

Wayne Mullins:

You have to convince, you have to persuade other people.

Wayne Mullins:

If you're the entrepreneur to buy into the vision, to buy into

Wayne Mullins:

the mission of your organization.

Wayne Mullins:

And you can present it.

Wayne Mullins:

You could read it off a piece of paper.

Wayne Mullins:

You could email it out to everyone.

Wayne Mullins:

And chances are, it's not going to go over well because you haven't

Wayne Mullins:

thought through a strategy.

Wayne Mullins:

You haven't thought through a plan to position.

Wayne Mullins:

The vision, the mission in such a way that actually does what it

Wayne Mullins:

actually persuades people that they should be on board with this thing.

Wayne Mullins:

I see this all the time, Dallas.

Wayne Mullins:

I see where an example of that, you know, somebody comes out with a strategic plan.

Wayne Mullins:

So we're at the time of recording, this is the end of the year.

Wayne Mullins:

And so a lot of talk about strategic planning and a lot of people are rolling

Wayne Mullins:

out strategic plans for the next year for their companies in the problem.

Wayne Mullins:

And the complaint I often hear is that.

Wayne Mullins:

No one buys into the plan, right?

Wayne Mullins:

It becomes a sheet of paper or document that sits on a desk somewhere and

Wayne Mullins:

collects dust because no one buys into it.

Wayne Mullins:

And one of my first question is, how did you market this plan to your team?

Wayne Mullins:

And their response is usually, what do you mean?

Wayne Mullins:

And I go through the whole explanation that we're talking about now.

Wayne Mullins:

It's like, your job is to persuade them.

Wayne Mullins:

Your job is to convince them as to why this vision or this

Wayne Mullins:

plan is worth buying into.

Wayne Mullins:

And as Zig Ziglar used to say, one of the very first things we have

Wayne Mullins:

to learn to do is communicate.

Wayne Mullins:

What's in it for me, he used to talk about W yeah, that the radio station, right?

Wayne Mullins:

I remember that.

Wayne Mullins:

Yeah.

Wayne Mullins:

Yeah.

Wayne Mullins:

Again, very basic things, but here's what happens.

Wayne Mullins:

We spend the time, energy, and effort putting this plan together, strategic

Wayne Mullins:

plan together, vision together, whatever you want, whatever it is

Wayne Mullins:

for your department, for your role, you put this thing together, you then

Wayne Mullins:

pitch it to the person or to the team or to the board or whoever it is in.

Wayne Mullins:

The response is very blah, right?

Wayne Mullins:

It's very, okay, whatever.

Wayne Mullins:

It's another plan.

Wayne Mullins:

We'll do it when we won't do it.

Wayne Mullins:

And the complaint then becomes those people just aren't motivated.

Wayne Mullins:

Those people just don't want to buy in those people.

Wayne Mullins:

And here's the thing I love to say.

Wayne Mullins:

Anytime we begin the sentence with those people are there.

Wayne Mullins:

It's probably time that we stop and reflect and look in the mirror

Wayne Mullins:

first because we didn't do a good enough job of positioning and

Wayne Mullins:

persuading and understanding why should they even care to begin with.

Wayne Mullins:

And that's so much about marketing, right?

Wayne Mullins:

Marketing is about helping people understand why they should care, what's

Wayne Mullins:

in it for them, what's the benefit for them in all of us as leaders.

Wayne Mullins:

We could learn to lean into that a bit more, learn to lean into our role

Wayne Mullins:

to persuade, to convince, to help them understand why they should care.

Wayne Mullins:

I love

Dallas Burnett:

that.

Dallas Burnett:

And I love how you take the personal responsibility.

Dallas Burnett:

If you ever, if you're saying those people don't do this or that, or think this way

Dallas Burnett:

that we're already at a deficit, we're already messing up because as a leader.

Dallas Burnett:

It is the first person you should look on is in the mirror.

Dallas Burnett:

If you're not getting the results from your people, because we can always

Dallas Burnett:

do a better job at communicating.

Dallas Burnett:

And I think asking ourself the question, have I communicated in a way

Dallas Burnett:

that really helps them see what's in it for them, what's in it for them.

Dallas Burnett:

And.

Dallas Burnett:

What's in it for me and everybody.

Dallas Burnett:

It's, and, and that doesn't, and I think some people get lost on that, is it's a,

Dallas Burnett:

it's a salesy tactic or like this used car salesman approach to sell vision.

Dallas Burnett:

That's not it at all because if you're approaching your company, your

Dallas Burnett:

organization, or your team, as if everyone is there and we can all have a win, then

Dallas Burnett:

I'm not having to be salesy in terms of a used car salesman approach and try

Dallas Burnett:

to pull something over somebody's eyes.

Dallas Burnett:

As a leader, you truly have to think like that.

Dallas Burnett:

You've got to think of the wind so that you can then communicate that and

Dallas Burnett:

it's an authentic, it's an authentic.

Dallas Burnett:

So then it's not about being inauthentic and trying to pull

Dallas Burnett:

the wool over somebody's eyes.

Dallas Burnett:

It's about coming up with a vision, a mission, a values, a purpose that truly

Dallas Burnett:

does resonate because it is a win.

Dallas Burnett:

And then it's just down to, can you communicate that effectively and

Dallas Burnett:

clearly and compellingly enough to get that buy in so I think that.

Dallas Burnett:

I think that's very well said, very well said.

Dallas Burnett:

I like that.

Wayne Mullins:

Yeah.

Wayne Mullins:

I'll, I'll mention one quick thing that's completely unrelated, but

Wayne Mullins:

I'll tie it back to this Dallas.

Wayne Mullins:

It's this.

Wayne Mullins:

So there's an author out there that I really enjoy his books, Ryan Holiday.

Wayne Mullins:

He's written quite a few books that I enjoy.

Wayne Mullins:

Uh, and Ryan Holiday.

Dallas Burnett:

Obstacle is the way, right?

Dallas Burnett:

Isn't that Ryan Holiday?

Dallas Burnett:

Obstacle is the way?

Wayne Mullins:

Yeah.

Wayne Mullins:

Obstacle is the way.

Wayne Mullins:

Love that.

Wayne Mullins:

Yep.

Wayne Mullins:

But he has this thing when he talks about writing that he spends a year

Wayne Mullins:

doing research, a year doing writing, and then a year promoting the book.

Wayne Mullins:

And so for us as leaders or as managers.

Wayne Mullins:

It's important to remember that same framework, right?

Wayne Mullins:

We do the research, we then put the plan together, and then

Wayne Mullins:

typically we walk away, right?

Wayne Mullins:

We hand them the plan and we say, wash our hands, our work is done.

Wayne Mullins:

I did the plan.

Wayne Mullins:

Y'all go execute on the plan.

Wayne Mullins:

We forget that last bit, that last third.

Wayne Mullins:

Is the sales approach, right?

Wayne Mullins:

That last third is the persuasion.

Wayne Mullins:

That last third is getting the buy in from everyone else.

Wayne Mullins:

So if I could challenge people listening with that one thing,

Wayne Mullins:

it's like, do your research, do your presentation piece, right?

Wayne Mullins:

The actual thing, put the thing together, but then don't forget

Wayne Mullins:

a third of your work is to be.

Wayne Mullins:

Don, steal after you've done the thing, right?

Wayne Mullins:

After you've presented the thing, you still have a third

Wayne Mullins:

of your work left to do.

Wayne Mullins:

So if we just embrace that kind of mental thought that the work isn't

Wayne Mullins:

done yet just because I presented it, that will help us not feel frustrated

Wayne Mullins:

when people don't jump up and down with excitement over our new plan.

Dallas Burnett:

Yeah, when you've done the research, you're

Dallas Burnett:

only a third of the way there.

Dallas Burnett:

And so it's like, Hey, you've got another two thirds to go in terms

Dallas Burnett:

of crafting it and delivering it.

Dallas Burnett:

And then, you know, really getting your hands dirty.

Dallas Burnett:

And when I, when you say that, it makes me think of the amount of

Dallas Burnett:

times that you have to remind people.

Dallas Burnett:

It's like when Ford, you know, has a F 150 commercial, they don't tell

Dallas Burnett:

16 year olds, okay, you know, now that you got your driver's license,

Dallas Burnett:

you need to buy a Ford truck.

Dallas Burnett:

And that's it.

Dallas Burnett:

They give them one commercial and they're 16 and it's done.

Dallas Burnett:

It's like, no, they spent the rest of their life.

Dallas Burnett:

Every time they turn on a sporting event or any kind of TV show, they're

Dallas Burnett:

going to, or any kind of social media, they're going to get this

Dallas Burnett:

advertisement saying you need a Ford F 150, 150 because Ford knows that it's.

Dallas Burnett:

It has to be continually sharing the vision of what it means to buy an F 150.

Dallas Burnett:

And so I think as leaders, we can't just go halfway.

Dallas Burnett:

We can have a great vision, great mission, great values.

Dallas Burnett:

But if we just put it out there and go, those people, they just didn't see it.

Dallas Burnett:

They didn't get it.

Dallas Burnett:

Let's go a step further and really dig into the details.

Dallas Burnett:

I want to talk about that because you are passionate about creating high

Dallas Burnett:

performing teams and building culture.

Dallas Burnett:

When you think about culture and creating a strong culture, growing a

Dallas Burnett:

strong culture, you have your company and your teams, and you work with many

Dallas Burnett:

entrepreneurs and companies and teams.

Dallas Burnett:

What is that?

Dallas Burnett:

What does that look like for you?

Dallas Burnett:

How do you approach that when you talk about strong cultures

Dallas Burnett:

and creating outperforming teams?

Dallas Burnett:

How would you, how do you

Wayne Mullins:

approach that?

Wayne Mullins:

Yeah, I would say the very first thing is that.

Wayne Mullins:

Your culture in your business, your organization, even in your family,

Wayne Mullins:

your culture is revealed when you as the leader are not present.

Wayne Mullins:

So your true culture isn't what happens when you're in the room.

Wayne Mullins:

It isn't what happens when you're in the building.

Wayne Mullins:

The true culture is revealed when you are not present.

Wayne Mullins:

That is the actual true culture.

Wayne Mullins:

So if you want to get a better feel for your actual true culture.

Wayne Mullins:

You have to do some research into what actually takes place

Wayne Mullins:

when you are not present.

Wayne Mullins:

But when it comes to building a strong culture, again, I think

Wayne Mullins:

about marketing and advertising and the confusion of those words.

Wayne Mullins:

I think that we have to first understand what is culture because

Wayne Mullins:

over the last few years, culture has become sort of a buzzword, right?

Wayne Mullins:

Everyone is talking about company and organization culture, right?

Wayne Mullins:

Culture comes from the same Latin word as cultivate.

Wayne Mullins:

Yeah.

Wayne Mullins:

And so when we think about cultivating, it's a farming term, right?

Wayne Mullins:

We have to cultivate the soil.

Wayne Mullins:

And here's the interesting thing Dallas about cultivating the soul is

Wayne Mullins:

that we do have to cultivate the soul initially to break it up, to break up

Wayne Mullins:

the rocks, to break up the hard soul.

Wayne Mullins:

But then in order to cultivate it properly, we also have to add

Wayne Mullins:

nutrients into that soul sometimes.

Wayne Mullins:

We also have to know what is present and what is not present, right?

Wayne Mullins:

We can't just start adding nutrients to the soul.

Wayne Mullins:

If they already exist there, right?

Wayne Mullins:

If we're adding one certain type of nutrient and it's already there,

Wayne Mullins:

we're wasting time, we're wasting energy, we're wasting effort.

Wayne Mullins:

So we have to get clear about what is present in the soil.

Wayne Mullins:

Then once we plant the seeds in that soil, the cultivation is still not done, right?

Wayne Mullins:

Because what happens once the seeds are there and they start to grow and they

Wayne Mullins:

start to sprout, these little things start popping up everywhere called weeds.

Wayne Mullins:

And so the way farmers Take care of those weeds in big gardens is

Wayne Mullins:

they cultivate, they teal between the rows to remove those weeds out.

Wayne Mullins:

And so when we think about culture is not something that you set and forget, right?

Wayne Mullins:

You cannot just set this thing up like we're going to do culture

Wayne Mullins:

once a year at our annual event.

Wayne Mullins:

We're going to do culture.

Wayne Mullins:

Maybe once a quarter, when we get together as a quarterly team

Wayne Mullins:

meeting, that's going to be our, we're going to focus on culture.

Wayne Mullins:

Yeah, that is not what sets and creates culture.

Wayne Mullins:

And I love the quote.

Wayne Mullins:

I think it was, uh, Peter Drucker, maybe who said culture

Wayne Mullins:

eats strategy for breakfast.

Wayne Mullins:

Culture eats strategy for breakfast.

Wayne Mullins:

Exactly right.

Wayne Mullins:

Yeah.

Wayne Mullins:

And a few years ago, we witnessed that firsthand, right?

Wayne Mullins:

So a few years ago, as this pandemic swept around the world, all of these

Wayne Mullins:

organizations had developed and had strategies in place for that year, right?

Wayne Mullins:

They had all these things that poured time and attention.

Wayne Mullins:

They had these wonderful strategies in place.

Wayne Mullins:

And then immediately As March rolled around that year, those strategies

Wayne Mullins:

went out the window really quickly.

Wayne Mullins:

And what happened when those strategies went away is the true

Wayne Mullins:

culture was revealed in those moments.

Wayne Mullins:

And that is where we ended up with kind of this whole notion of, you

Wayne Mullins:

know, so many organizations started talking about no one wants to work.

Wayne Mullins:

No one wants to show up in the reality was the pandemic

Wayne Mullins:

didn't break people's cultures.

Wayne Mullins:

The pandemic merely revealed the true cultures that already existed.

Dallas Burnett:

I love that, man.

Dallas Burnett:

Oh, we could talk for, we'd need another four or five episodes to go through all

Dallas Burnett:

of that in great detail, because I can, I can totally see what you're saying.

Dallas Burnett:

I love the fact that you point out.

Dallas Burnett:

The root word, basis of culture and the idea of cultivation.

Dallas Burnett:

And I think that when you listen to what you were describing to me, when it, when

Dallas Burnett:

you were describing that, like all the actions that one takes to create this

Dallas Burnett:

healthy plant, you know, you're adding nutrients, you're tilling the soil.

Dallas Burnett:

You're preparing the way you're adding the nutrients for it to thrive.

Dallas Burnett:

You're removing obstacles like weeds that are growing up, choked out.

Dallas Burnett:

All these are things are, it's a very action oriented thing.

Dallas Burnett:

And I think that when you overlay that.

Dallas Burnett:

Against your first statement about culture is a lot, has a lot to do with

Dallas Burnett:

what is going on when you're not there, you know, what, and, and so when you

Dallas Burnett:

look at those two things together, it's like saying this, when culture has a

Dallas Burnett:

lot to do with what people are doing intentionally and to create something.

Dallas Burnett:

And so it's like, even when you're not there, and so it's like, what

Dallas Burnett:

activities, if you want to know what your culture of your company is.

Dallas Burnett:

What activities are you routinely engaging in, deliberately, intentionally,

Dallas Burnett:

or even unintentionally, that are so consistent it's creating something?

Dallas Burnett:

What are you cultivating?

Dallas Burnett:

Alright, and then I think when we look at the strength of a culture,

Dallas Burnett:

you know, if you can't take a vacation without things falling apart.

Dallas Burnett:

And that's, you know, that's telling about the culture of the company.

Dallas Burnett:

If you are saying we have this culture and we have, we ascribe to these values

Dallas Burnett:

and yet the plant that you're growing is either withering or it's not, it's,

Dallas Burnett:

you're growing an apple tree and it's in the, and there's an orange tree there.

Dallas Burnett:

Like, you know, whatever, you know, it just, it really, it

Dallas Burnett:

speaks to the, the strength of it.

Dallas Burnett:

If you can, if your, your activities are in alignment with creating

Dallas Burnett:

that healthy plant, I think that has a lot to do with the strength.

Dallas Burnett:

So I think that culture is such a, it's like you said, it's a, it's a buzzword,

Dallas Burnett:

but it's a buzzword that nobody really takes the time to understand and

Dallas Burnett:

understand that how, how it's, it goes back to where we started the conversation

Dallas Burnett:

is that there's some foundational things that we can be consistent

Dallas Burnett:

about that we can do and put in place.

Dallas Burnett:

And, and it's those some, somewhat some boring things like people don't

Dallas Burnett:

understand connection and relationships.

Dallas Burnett:

You can get lost in the transaction, but if you don't have a relationship

Dallas Burnett:

with someone or connection with someone, it doesn't matter if you have

Dallas Burnett:

an SOP long term, because then all of a sudden COVID hits and they don't

Dallas Burnett:

show up because there's no connection, there's no real reason for them to.

Dallas Burnett:

And so I just think there's so many things there with that analogy

Dallas Burnett:

that you described that is so true.

Dallas Burnett:

I think it's a very good analogy with, with culture and it's important.

Dallas Burnett:

So what are some things that you like?

Dallas Burnett:

You know, I, we talked a little bit about, we had a book come out as well in October.

Dallas Burnett:

We talk a lot, you know, one of the things that we, we talk about in the book

Dallas Burnett:

is a unique, it's different, is as it relates to building culture is, is ritual.

Dallas Burnett:

And I feel like rituals are lost in, in business a lot of times because

Dallas Burnett:

they, we just don't see the value of that, but rituals are not some

Dallas Burnett:

kind of religious thing necessarily.

Dallas Burnett:

It's a shared experience and it's something that we're doing in, you know,

Dallas Burnett:

when we want to make, we want to take a big idea and to squeeze it into something

Dallas Burnett:

physical, you know, a lot of times.

Dallas Burnett:

But if it's a end of the year celebration where we can get up and recognize

Dallas Burnett:

people and we have a ceremony for them, I mean, that's something that we can

Dallas Burnett:

do in a way that has people talking about it or even if it's taking people

Dallas Burnett:

out every month for their birthday.

Dallas Burnett:

What are some things that you have done in your organization, your company that

Dallas Burnett:

you feel whether it's rituals or not?

Dallas Burnett:

That really helps strengthen your culture.

Wayne Mullins:

Yeah.

Wayne Mullins:

That's such a loaded question for me, Dallas, because I feel

Wayne Mullins:

there's so many things that we do with intention now, right?

Wayne Mullins:

Before I didn't believe that I was a good leader, that I was a good manager.

Wayne Mullins:

Therefore, there was nothing I could do about it, right?

Wayne Mullins:

It was their fault.

Wayne Mullins:

They were lazy.

Wayne Mullins:

They didn't want to work all these things.

Wayne Mullins:

And since I've decided to shift that identity.

Wayne Mullins:

And lean into figuring out as a good leader, as a good manager, there are

Wayne Mullins:

so many things now that are rituals.

Wayne Mullins:

So many things that are routine that honestly, between you and I, and even

Wayne Mullins:

my team knows this, I hate, there's some things I hate doing, but I

Wayne Mullins:

know that it's good for the culture.

Wayne Mullins:

And two things come to mind.

Wayne Mullins:

Number one is that I've yet to meet a person Dallas that likes

Wayne Mullins:

someone who is a hypocrite.

Wayne Mullins:

Yet, as leaders, as managers, so often we attempt to hold people to a different

Wayne Mullins:

standard than we hold ourselves to.

Wayne Mullins:

Specifically, what I mean by that is, human nature says that when

Wayne Mullins:

we look around, we judge other people based on their actions.

Wayne Mullins:

But we judge ourselves based on our intention.

Wayne Mullins:

So an example of that.

Wayne Mullins:

Someone comes into work late.

Wayne Mullins:

So we're supposed to be here, let's just say eight o'clock in the morning.

Wayne Mullins:

Someone comes in at 820.

Wayne Mullins:

So I judge them based on their action.

Wayne Mullins:

I say, huh, in my head, I'm thinking.

Wayne Mullins:

You know, they're lazy.

Wayne Mullins:

They probably overslept.

Wayne Mullins:

They're probably out partying.

Wayne Mullins:

They, you know, all these things because they were late.

Wayne Mullins:

Now, if it was me coming in at 820, I say, I'm, you know, I was rushing to get here.

Wayne Mullins:

I had a flat tire.

Wayne Mullins:

The kids were sick or I had to bring the kids here, right?

Wayne Mullins:

My intention was to be here at eight.

Wayne Mullins:

Sure.

Wayne Mullins:

I didn't make it.

Wayne Mullins:

But I give myself a pass because my intention was in the right place.

Wayne Mullins:

And so as leaders, I think it's important just to remember that when we look

Wayne Mullins:

around, that we by default judge people solely based on the action that we see.

Wayne Mullins:

And there's so much more missing to the story, always there's so much

Wayne Mullins:

more missing to that story that is so important to understand their intention

Wayne Mullins:

was probably in the right place.

Wayne Mullins:

But they didn't execute because something came up and what

Wayne Mullins:

ties hand in hand with that.

Wayne Mullins:

And I, I think this is unique.

Wayne Mullins:

Um, and this is a challenge for us because for me as a leader by default, my default

Wayne Mullins:

is to be suspicious of other people.

Wayne Mullins:

Like that's the way I'm wired.

Wayne Mullins:

I don't trust people, right?

Wayne Mullins:

I think part of that is American culture in general.

Wayne Mullins:

We tend to be a very suspicious, non trusting culture.

Wayne Mullins:

One of the very first conversations that I have with any new hire,

Wayne Mullins:

when I meet with them one on one is this, we default here to trust.

Wayne Mullins:

In other words, we trust you.

Wayne Mullins:

We trust that you're going to do the right thing.

Wayne Mullins:

We trust that you're going to live up to our expectations that you've agreed to.

Wayne Mullins:

We trust that you're going to live out our core values, which again,

Wayne Mullins:

you're aware of, you've agreed to, you know, live up to these things.

Wayne Mullins:

Yeah.

Wayne Mullins:

We're going to default to trust, but.

Wayne Mullins:

You will have the opportunity from time to cause us to have suspicion.

Wayne Mullins:

Your job is to not give us those reasons because we already trust you.

Wayne Mullins:

We trust that you're going to do the right things.

Wayne Mullins:

We trust you.

Wayne Mullins:

And that is a very foreign conversation for most people, Dallas.

Wayne Mullins:

They're not used to that.

Wayne Mullins:

One of our most recent hires.

Wayne Mullins:

So every week we meet in a team meeting and everyone puts their commitments.

Wayne Mullins:

On the big screen for everyone to see.

Wayne Mullins:

So we have a commitment that we make for this week.

Wayne Mullins:

And so next week on the screen, we highlight in either green, meaning we

Wayne Mullins:

did that commitment yellow, meaning we did part of that commitment or red,

Wayne Mullins:

meaning we didn't do that commitment.

Wayne Mullins:

And so one of our most recent hires came to me one day and we were actually

Wayne Mullins:

at lunch, he said, all these people are marking all these various things

Wayne Mullins:

green every week, how do you actually know they're doing these things?

Wayne Mullins:

And my answer was.

Wayne Mullins:

Because I trust them.

Wayne Mullins:

And so we had this whole conversation around how that

Wayne Mullins:

is the default of this culture.

Wayne Mullins:

And I was very blunt with this person.

Wayne Mullins:

I said, look, if you are questioning, if other people are lying, I said, a great

Wayne Mullins:

place to start would be with yourself.

Wayne Mullins:

Like are you feeling a bit conflicted by some of your responses, but the way

Wayne Mullins:

you're putting some of your answers on this screen, that is the place to start.

Wayne Mullins:

And like you said earlier, I'm a huge proponent and believer.

Wayne Mullins:

All leadership.

Wayne Mullins:

Starts with the person in the mirror, that is where leadership starts.

Wayne Mullins:

And so that's the conversation I had with this.

Wayne Mullins:

Again, brand new hire been here, you know, a month or two at the time.

Wayne Mullins:

And that though, sets the tone for the culture as well.

Wayne Mullins:

Right.

Dallas Burnett:

Yes.

Dallas Burnett:

I think it shows too, you're consistent because you know, if you say on your

Dallas Burnett:

first day, we trust you and then you just go and say, did you do this?

Dallas Burnett:

Did you do that?

Dallas Burnett:

Did you do that?

Dallas Burnett:

And you just, your actions don't cultivate trust back to your old analogy.

Dallas Burnett:

Right.

Dallas Burnett:

And then there's a, it's like.

Dallas Burnett:

Dissonance or resistance, because it's like, wait a minute, it's

Dallas Burnett:

not, it's like you're talking about, there's a hypocrisy there.

Dallas Burnett:

And I think sometimes leaders, whether it's out of fear or whatever, will,

Dallas Burnett:

will not be consistent on that.

Dallas Burnett:

I think you're doing a great job by stating the value.

Dallas Burnett:

We trust you.

Dallas Burnett:

This is our MO.

Dallas Burnett:

That's what you have on day one.

Dallas Burnett:

And then allowing that to play out.

Dallas Burnett:

So you're not going back and saying, you, you said green, but did you

Dallas Burnett:

really, did you, can you show me that?

Dallas Burnett:

Can you prove that you got that?

Dallas Burnett:

I mean, but, but to your point, you know, that person, it was almost so

Dallas Burnett:

foreign to them at first when you were sitting there having a conversation.

Dallas Burnett:

Well, how do you know that?

Dallas Burnett:

Because we trust people, that's how we operate and, and something about that

Dallas Burnett:

was making them feel uncomfortable.

Dallas Burnett:

But I think that's so good because then it gives you that opportunity

Dallas Burnett:

to have the conversation and say, this is what trust looks like here.

Dallas Burnett:

It means that when people put green on their screen, it's green because

Dallas Burnett:

they said it is because we trust them.

Dallas Burnett:

And I think that's so cool because you've tied so many different elements there.

Dallas Burnett:

I love too, how you're making commitments every week.

Dallas Burnett:

One of the things that our coaching system is making

Dallas Burnett:

commitments and we do it monthly.

Dallas Burnett:

But I love it because, and I love the accountability piece because you're

Dallas Burnett:

saying, this is what I'm going to do.

Dallas Burnett:

And even though you trust them, they say, if it's green is green, you're

Dallas Burnett:

still putting it up and saying, I want everybody in this, on this call to

Dallas Burnett:

know this is what I'm committed to.

Dallas Burnett:

And there's an accountability piece of that.

Dallas Burnett:

I love that.

Dallas Burnett:

That's so awesome.

Dallas Burnett:

That's so awesome.

Dallas Burnett:

And it's a safe place to be accountable because I can put green or red

Dallas Burnett:

and it's like, okay, I, you know.

Dallas Burnett:

But you're still putting yourself out there and still making commitments

Dallas Burnett:

on what you want to do this week.

Dallas Burnett:

So well

Wayne Mullins:

done.

Wayne Mullins:

Thank you.

Wayne Mullins:

Thank you.

Wayne Mullins:

What I would say though, tying back to mere leadership, like I have

Wayne Mullins:

commitments on the screen as well.

Wayne Mullins:

I have expectations that I have to live up to as well.

Wayne Mullins:

In other words, I don't hold them to a different standard than I hold myself to.

Wayne Mullins:

Right.

Wayne Mullins:

I am the, in this case, I'm the owner, I am the founder of this

Wayne Mullins:

company, 100 percent ownership.

Wayne Mullins:

So there's no one to tell me what to do, how to do it.

Wayne Mullins:

Every single day I clock in when I get to work, I clock out when I go to lunch,

Wayne Mullins:

I clock out when I leave for the day.

Wayne Mullins:

I hold myself to the same standard that I expect other people to live at.

Wayne Mullins:

And I see it so many times where we have different expectations for

Wayne Mullins:

other people than we're unwilling to hold ourselves to those things.

Dallas Burnett:

I think that's awesome.

Dallas Burnett:

I think that said, again, it goes back to consistency and the culture

Dallas Burnett:

that you're trying to create.

Dallas Burnett:

And as the leader, if you're saying, this is what we espouse and this is what we say

Dallas Burnett:

we're about, this is what we do, you got to be willing to walk the walk, you know?

Dallas Burnett:

And I think that's really great, man.

Dallas Burnett:

This has just been outstanding.

Dallas Burnett:

I love this.

Dallas Burnett:

I think this is fantastic conversation.

Dallas Burnett:

I would love to, I would love to ask you a question at the end of our show.

Dallas Burnett:

We always ask listeners who is someone they would like to listen

Dallas Burnett:

to or watch on the last 10%.

Dallas Burnett:

And it can be anybody.

Dallas Burnett:

Some people say famous people, some people say their cousin, some people

Dallas Burnett:

say a friend of theirs doesn't matter.

Dallas Burnett:

Who would you like to see or hear on the

Wayne Mullins:

last 10%?

Wayne Mullins:

Yeah.

Wayne Mullins:

That's a really tough question.

Wayne Mullins:

The answer I would go to though is, you know, we're in, our

Wayne Mullins:

office is located in downtown.

Wayne Mullins:

We're in a small town, but downtown.

Wayne Mullins:

And there's a lot of foot traffic in front of our building because

Wayne Mullins:

the bus station's down here.

Wayne Mullins:

And what I've learned over the years of being located down here is that

Wayne Mullins:

every person has a very unique story.

Wayne Mullins:

And sometimes we get so wrapped up in our own stuff, our own lives, our own That

Wayne Mullins:

the stories around us get missed out on.

Wayne Mullins:

And so the answer to your question would be, I would love for it to be

Wayne Mullins:

just a random person walking by because again, for people, yeah, for people

Wayne Mullins:

like you who are great at what you do, which is drawing out right through

Wayne Mullins:

interviewing, through asking questions.

Wayne Mullins:

You could extract those stories and then within every story, there's always

Wayne Mullins:

life lessons that come out of that.

Wayne Mullins:

I love that.

Wayne Mullins:

Very

Dallas Burnett:

good.

Dallas Burnett:

That's the first time.

Dallas Burnett:

That's the first, that's the first answer we've heard like that.

Dallas Burnett:

That's a very cool.

Dallas Burnett:

But I love that.

Dallas Burnett:

I love just the, the random man on the street interview or

Dallas Burnett:

woman on the street interview.

Dallas Burnett:

I love that.

Dallas Burnett:

Okay.

Dallas Burnett:

All right.

Dallas Burnett:

We'll see, we'll see if we can't do something like that in the future.

Dallas Burnett:

Cause I do like that idea.

Dallas Burnett:

Maybe we could, maybe we could structure a show or something like that.

Dallas Burnett:

That would be a, that would be a really cool episode.

Dallas Burnett:

Maybe.

Dallas Burnett:

All right.

Dallas Burnett:

So we have talked about so many things and you've added, I think,

Dallas Burnett:

tremendous value to the listeners today.

Dallas Burnett:

I'm sure everybody's enjoyed this episode.

Dallas Burnett:

If something you said has resonated with them and they would like to get

Dallas Burnett:

in touch with you, whether it's about marketing or culture or your accelerator

Dallas Burnett:

program or anything, the book, how can people find you and what you do?

Dallas Burnett:

So

Wayne Mullins:

two places, first is the website, ugly mug, marketing.

Wayne Mullins:

com.

Wayne Mullins:

All of our contact info is there.

Wayne Mullins:

All of our company, you know, social channels are there.

Wayne Mullins:

And then the other would be my personal Instagram page,

Wayne Mullins:

which is where I post the most.

Wayne Mullins:

That's just at fire yourself and I pushed all kinds of life stuff there as well.

Dallas Burnett:

Okay.

Dallas Burnett:

At fire yourself.

Dallas Burnett:

We'll put both of those in the show notes so that you'll have access to that.

Dallas Burnett:

If you've listened to the last 10 percent in your car, don't

Dallas Burnett:

stop and write anything down.

Dallas Burnett:

Just look at the show notes after the show.

Dallas Burnett:

Thank you again, Wayne, for this has just been a fantastic conversation.

Dallas Burnett:

I appreciate your time and all that you do.

Dallas Burnett:

And thank you for your work at Ugly Mug and thank you for being an advocate for

Dallas Burnett:

culture and performance and just all the things we've talked about today.

Dallas Burnett:

It's been very good, enlightening conversation.

Wayne Mullins:

Thank you so much Dallas for the opportunity.

Wayne Mullins:

And one, one closing thought for me is just simply this, that

Wayne Mullins:

consistency creates miracles.

Wayne Mullins:

So whether that's as a parent, a husband, a leader, whatever it

Wayne Mullins:

may be, that when we learn to be consistent, miracles will occur.

Wayne Mullins:

I love it.

Dallas Burnett:

I love it.

Dallas Burnett:

Thanks, Wayne.

Dallas Burnett:

Have a great week.

DJ:

Thanks for joining us today on The Last 10%.

DJ:

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DJ:

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DJ:

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DJ:

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About the Podcast

The Last 10%
Inspiring People, Coaching Teams, and Improving Cultures
Join The Last 10% for incredible conversations that help uncover the secrets of what it takes to finish well and finish strong. Our guests share their journeys, hardships, and valuable advice. We release new episodes every other Tuesday. If you are a leader, a coach, a business owner, or someone looking to level up, you are in the right place!

You can give 90% effort and make it a long way. But it’s the finding out how to unlock the last 10% that makes all the difference in your life, your relationships, and your work.

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Dallas Burnett